A Mysterious Death in the Arkansas Night and the Battle for Answers
Apr 06, 2024Season 3Episode 1
Murder and Mimosas
Peel back the veil of a small Arkansas town's darkest hour as we recount the chilling, unresolved "boys on the track" case. A summer night's illegal deer spotlighting spree for teenagers Kevin Ives and Don Henry tragically ends on the train tracks—but was it truly an accident? The initial ruling rapidly dissolves under scrutiny, with a suspicious tarp and a curious lack of blood at the scene raising more questions than answers. Dig with us into the families' agonizing quest for justice, punctuated by Linda Ives's heart-wrenching open letter, and the unnerving pattern of witnesses meeting untimely fates, weaving a tale of potential cover-ups and miscarried investigations.
The murky depths of Arkansas's underbelly surface as drug trafficking and political corruption intertwine with the boys' fate. Barry Seal's assassination just a year prior hints at the sinister undercurrents at play; Jean Duffy's brave yet stifled fight against a corrupted system exposes the chilling reality of authority's dark alliances. We parse through grand jury testimonies and depositions, revealing a justice system precariously balanced on the scales of power. Engage with us in the complex narrative of a community shackled by fear, where whistleblowers are silenced, and the truth remains shrouded in shadows.
In this heart-stopping narrative, every twist and turn sheds light on an unsolved mystery that refuses to fade into obscurity. We navigate a labyrinth of clues, connections, and local lore—leaving no stone unturned and no dark corner unexamined. The episode concludes with an impassioned call to armchair detectives and truth-seekers alike: join the conversation, share your thoughts, and perhaps together, we can inch closer to unraveling the enigma that is the "boys on the track" case.
Peel back the veil of a small Arkansas town's darkest hour as we recount the chilling, unresolved "boys on the track" case. A summer night's illegal deer spotlighting spree for teenagers Kevin Ives and Don Henry tragically ends on the train tracks—but was it truly an accident? The initial ruling rapidly dissolves under scrutiny, with a suspicious tarp and a curious lack of blood at the scene raising more questions than answers. Dig with us into the families' agonizing quest for justice, punctuated by Linda Ives's heart-wrenching open letter, and the unnerving pattern of witnesses meeting untimely fates, weaving a tale of potential cover-ups and miscarried investigations.
The murky depths of Arkansas's underbelly surface as drug trafficking and political corruption intertwine with the boys' fate. Barry Seal's assassination just a year prior hints at the sinister undercurrents at play; Jean Duffy's brave yet stifled fight against a corrupted system exposes the chilling reality of authority's dark alliances. We parse through grand jury testimonies and depositions, revealing a justice system precariously balanced on the scales of power. Engage with us in the complex narrative of a community shackled by fear, where whistleblowers are silenced, and the truth remains shrouded in shadows.
In this heart-stopping narrative, every twist and turn sheds light on an unsolved mystery that refuses to fade into obscurity. We navigate a labyrinth of clues, connections, and local lore—leaving no stone unturned and no dark corner unexamined. The episode concludes with an impassioned call to armchair detectives and truth-seekers alike: join the conversation, share your thoughts, and perhaps together, we can inch closer to unraveling the enigma that is the "boys on the track" case.
Darkcast Network. Welcome to the dark side of podcasting.
Speaker 2:
Welcome to Murder and Mimosas, a true crime podcast brought to you by a mother and daughter duo.
Speaker 1:
Bringing you murder stories with a mimosas in hand.
Speaker 3:
Just a quick disclaimer before we get started. Our show is Murder and Mimosas a true crime podcast. Before we get started, our show is Murder and Mimosas. It's a true crime podcast. This means that we do discuss crimes including, but not limited to, disappearances, murder and sexual assault. All our episodes are told with the respect of the victims and the victims' families in mind. We strive to ensure that we provide factual information, but some information is more verifiable than others.
Speaker 1:
With that, grab your mimosas and let's dive in. Welcome back, I'm Shannon and I'm Danica. Today we're going to cover what most people in Arkansas refer to as the boys on the track, but the tragic deaths of Kevin Ives and Don Henry. So grab your mimosas, you sip while we share. It's Saturday, august 1987 in Arkansas, which means hot, humid days with little relief at night.
Speaker 1:
Two bright teenagers, 17-year-old Kevin Ives and 16-year-old Dawn Henry, are cruising the strip on Grier Springs Road in LeBrock, arkansas, because, well, that's what you did in the 80s. It was their last official weekend of summer break. School would be starting on Monday, and Kevin was supposed to be home by midnight, but called his mother out of payphone and asked could he spend the night with Don? Linda didn't know Don well and she said no, the only other time he had spent the night with Don and his Don and his father had gotten a fight and they left, and Kevin stayed with another friend for the night, as teens do, though he begged, and she realized he's 17 and about to start his senior year. She had to let go a little and she decided he could stay, but on the condition he was still at Dawn's by midnight. And he agreed, and they do get to Dawn's house around midnight, dawn asks his dad. Once they get there, though, can they go spotlighting for deer in the woods at their house?
Speaker 3:
and his father agrees okay, you can't live in Arkansas and not hear about boys on the track. However, I feel like I know like the bare minimum kind of the basics, so I'll probably have a lot of questions. I also know from living in Arkansas, though, is spotlighting deer is illegal, and I mean in August. Is that even deer season? It?
Speaker 1:
is not legal, and I'm not really sure why his father agreed to let them. But whatever and no, it's not deer season at this time. I too knew the story somewhat, but not to the extent I do now. I spent weeks going down one rabbit hole after another because there was just so much to learn. So, looking at a map, dawn lived in a trailer park that had a large wooded area behind it, and if you continue to go through the woods you will come to a train tracks. The boys had out there with a flashlight and a shotgun.
Speaker 1:
Dawn's father woke up around four that morning and checked on the boys. They weren't there, but their cars were still there in the driveway, and by six that morning he decided he would go look for the boys. He got in his truck and took off. He didn't find them, and by 10 am he was calling Linda and asked were the boys at her house? Did she know where they were? She, of course, said no, I thought they were with you.
Speaker 1:
During the early morning hours, though, around 4 am, there was a train traveling from Texarkana going about 55 miles an hour with a spotlight on the front, when the engineer and the conductor and the brake man noticed that something dark is on the tracks in front of them. They put the emergency brake on right away and blew the whistle. As they approached the tracks, they see two boys lying on the tracks in identical positions with their hands to their side. They are hoping, against hope, that the boys are going to move in time, but they don't, which was something else they all thought was very strange. The boys didn't move at all, they didn't even flinch. They had a tarp covering their bodies from their waist down, and they could see a shotgun lying by one of the boys too.
Speaker 1:
So once the train came to a screeching halt, the conductor, jim Tomlin, and the brakeman got out of the train to access the area, and while the engineer stayed on board to radio for help, the boys' bodies had been cut in two with the train, and this, of course, was a bloody scene for sure. But something really isn't sitting right with Jerry. He is an avid hunter and has killed his share of game. While there is a lot of blood, he notices that the blood doesn't really seem quite right. He knew that something freshly killed has a lot of blood flowing from it. While, yes, there was a lot of blood, it didn't seem like the amount you would expect, and something else bothered him. It wasn't the amount you would expect either, and it was much darker than you expect from fresh blood.
Speaker 3:
Okay, well, does he tell this to the?
Speaker 1:
police. All three of them tell this to the police and plenty of other things, but you will soon find out it doesn't really matter. And once the police arrived, they immediately declared this an accident and didn't work it as a homicide at all, although all three on the train told them this was not an accident by any means. The boys didn't move at all. The paramedics voiced their concern about the lack of blood, but in the end they didn't have any means. The boys didn't move at all. The paramedics voiced their concern about the lack of blood, but in the end they didn't have any say. They also tell them about the tarp they saw and while waiting on the police, jerry took his flashlight and actually found the tarp because it had blown away. He says he told Deputy Tallent right where it was. The three were later told that they did not see a tarp and this was an optical illusion and that Deputy Talent would later deny that. Jerry even told him where the tarp was at all.
Speaker 3:
So this just happens to be an optical illusion that all three saw at the same time, not only before the accident, but after the accident.
Speaker 1:
Right, I mean it doesn't add up for me. Yeah, it doesn't add up at all, and, honestly, there really isn't even a lot of significance to the talk other than like they're just all seeing it. And this is really shoddy police work, in my opinion, because they don't even care, they're not even looking for it. So not only are they not aware of that, so they have the alleged gun that they see that the police aren't looking for, and Jerry said that he showed them right where that was too, although this never showed up in evidence either. Since they were declaring this an accident, they weren't going to send the bodies to the crime lab at all and they were going to send them straight to the funeral home, which they did protest other parties that were there and they did decide to redirect the bodies to the crime lab for autopsies the crime line for autopsies.
Speaker 3:
I mean thank god for these other parties who are putting up a protest, because that sounds at least like a positive thing happening in all of this negativity and chaos. And it's amazing that there were some outspoken people there that voiced their opinions when it really didn't have anything to pertain to them.
Speaker 1:
It does sound like a positive and in a way it is, but well, it's also a freaking nightmare.
Speaker 3:
That's true. Speaking of the nightmare, have the parents been informed of any of this?
Speaker 1:
So not at this point. Curtis heard a rumor that two boys were shot and tied to the railroad tracks and were dead, so he calls Linda right away and he released this information and told her to get over to his house right away.
Speaker 4:
Welcome to Zach Solved Mysteries, the most important podcast you'll ever hear in your life. I know enough about most things to be inaccurate about everything. We're not just a podcast, we're an experience.
Speaker 2:
This story f***s dude.
Speaker 4:
Prepare to have your life transformed, because not listening to us could be a grave mistake. You must wake up every day and say today's the day someone's going to murder me. We're not just tackling the classic mysteries of the past, we're rewriting history itself. Robert Stack, I think, had dirt on people. Forget everything you thought you knew about unsolved mysteries or any sort of mystery. Maybe there were giants, who knows? Who cares? Subscribe now to Zach Solve Mysteries. Anywhere you get your podcasts, get solved. Ha ha, mystery solved, my bitches.
Speaker 3:
Okay. So he like hears a rumor and I mean, had he even talked to the police to confirm this, or he just goes straight to Linda.
Speaker 1:
No, he just goes straight to Linda and you know how fast rumors go and I mean I can't really say that this is a small town, but I mean rumors go fast. So Linda gets there, she raced right over. She's so panicked and as she's pulling up, deputy Talon pulls up too. Curtis tells him what he's heard and asks if it's their voice. He says there's no evidence of them being shot or tied to the tracks and until they are able to IV the bodies with dental records, he can't say for sure if it's their voice. They do later get calls that verify that Don and Kevin are the boys on the track. The police are proposing that this is a double suicide and the Ives, as well as the Henrys, aren't buying this at all. Then the police say they found evidence of the boys using drugs Because they found marijuana in Kevin's pocket. You know.
Speaker 3:
I don't really know anybody who's ever done marijuana in any form or fashion and was like. You know it sounds good. Let's have a double suicide and let's do it in the worst way possible by laying down on some train tracks. But teens experiment with drugs. I am not in any way doubting that there were likely some weed in this teenager's pocket. Don't know how we're connecting the dots to double suicide on train tracks with that.
Speaker 1:
Right. So they don't think they would kill themselves either. So they wait for the autopsies to come in and Dr Malik calls the families down to the state police headquarters. And Dr Malik calls the families down to the state police headquarters. Joining them is also Lieutenant Frank Mitchell, as well as deputies Talent and Rick Eldendorf. This has nothing to do with the case, but just an oddity that I wanted to throw in there Once they are all there in the room.
Speaker 3:
Dr Malik requests to take a Polaroid picture of each of them individually before getting started. That is odd. What does he do with them?
Speaker 1:
So your guess is as good as mine. They agreed, but these families have just lost their sons and they don't need a photo op. I mean, yeah, right, exactly. So we'll talk more about Dr Malik in the future, but he is from Egypt and, while he does speak English, he has a strong accent that can be hard to understand and you know how we are here in the South, with our slow Southern drawl, and I can't imagine how this went.
Speaker 3:
True, we may not understand if you talk too fast.
Speaker 1:
That is true. May not understand if you talk too fast, that is true. So he tells the families that their sons died accidentally to due to thc intoxication. This is from the report and quote at 4 25 am on august 23rd 1987, larry kevin iams I was in dawn, george henry were were unconscious and in deep sleep on the railroad tracks under the psychedelic influence of THC when a train passed over them, causing their absolute death. End quote.
Speaker 3:
Okay. Um, psychedelic influence. This isn't acid LSD. Um, this isn't a psychedelic. This isn't said lsd. Um, this isn't a psychedelic. This isn't ayahuasca or mushrooms. What does that even mean, and how much do you have to ingest to get to the psychedelic state? Masking for a friend right.
Speaker 1:
This is just crazy. And linda is the only one really asking questions and she has that very question to Dr Malik and he shows them this chart that they completely don't understand and he goes into a lecture on THC that they keep repeating the question and then he says, do you want to see the autopsy photos? And begins to pull out photos out of this envelope, which Deputy Eldenorf stood up and took the envelope and advised him they don't want to see these photos. He then leaned in and said 20 joints is how much he told me it would take to accumulate to for the boys to have got to this state okay.
Speaker 3:
So I'm assuming we're talking 20 joints each. So we're talking 40 joints. That's also. That guy was a jerk to try to show them pictures. Let's start there. But 20 joints each is absurd. I would have to assume after a while you're so high that I mean how are you going to roll a joint or light it Like they're so high? How did they both get laid on the tracks together in the same position? Like it's just crazy to me these weird things they're throwing in to try to make their story make sense, and really to me it just makes it make less sense.
Speaker 1:
So well, that is a valid point that many people brought up two boys this high just aren't going to do that. They're not going to get on the tracks at the same position. How are they going to do any of this? So the Ives and the Henrys did not accept this conclusion at all. I mean, yes, there are times that parents or loved ones just can't accept the cause of death, but that's not really the case here. That's just not what's going on.
Speaker 3:
I mean we've had families reach out to us that felt like there was foul play. I mean we get those quite often and there are times that we look into it and feel like there wasn't. So I understand, but this isn't. I'm just saying, if a family member brought us this, sorry, I'm taking the family member's side because this isn't just not. This isn't a puzzle that's going together and the police are trying to force it together.
Speaker 1:
Right. So we know there is no investigation if the death certificate says accidental and they can't get anyone to listen to them. Then Linda gets a call from a man named Richard Garrett. He was the district deputy prosecuting attorney at the time. He was the district deputy prosecuting attorney at the time and he advised Linda he was thinking of holding a prosecutor's hearing and wondered how she felt about that. First she asked like what even is the prosecutor's hearing? And he told her it's a very rare hearing but was used for special inquiries such as when the cause of death is in dispute.
Speaker 1:
Explained it looked a lot like a grand jury but unlike the grand jury, this was not secret in any way. It's open to the public and basically the prosecutor could set aside the ME's cause of death with additional evidence and present it to a grand jury after that. So Linda talks it over with her husband Larry that night and she's all for it. I mean because at every chance he can get, sheriff James Steed gets his claws in the media telling them that there is absolutely no evidence whatsoever that would make anyone at all believe this was a homicide whatsoever that would make anyone at all believe this was a homicide. And she also decides to write a letter, an open letter, to her thoughts on the investigation, and she sends a copy to the bitten carrier, as well as to Sheriff James, steed and Danica. Do you want to read a portion of this letter that she sent to both of them?
Speaker 2:
The Missing Magnolias podcast tells the stories of the missing and murdered. Ultimately, these kids went into state custody and they never came out Together with missing persons expert Dr Michelle Shaughnessy, we uncover the real true crime experience.
Speaker 3:
Every time we do another interview I'm like how do we find so many badass women?
Speaker 2:
We hear from victims who turn their pain into something positive and experts who think outside the box to solve cases. Subscribe to Missing Magnolias on Apple, spotify or wherever you get your podcasts today.
Speaker 3:
Dear Sheriff Steed, you have stated that you are satisfied with the investigation your apartment has conducted into the death of my son, Kevin Ives, and his friend, Don Henry. You have also insinuated that our dissatisfaction with the investigation stems from the personal tragedy that we have suffered. I would like to point out to you, as well as the public, some of the reasons that we are dissatisfied. It is a fact that the area was never roped off or protected as a crime scene. The area could not possibly have been searched thoroughly for evidence of a crime. Whenever family and friends go down to the scene and recover a foot, the gun stock and other parts of the gun, Kevin and Don, as well as other person belongings, I consider this evidence of how well the area was searched. Okay, hang on, did I read that right? A foot was found later.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, family and friends went the next day and a foot was found also and other stuff mentioned. In fact, when the Ives went to get the autopsy reports, larry got a large piece of cardboard out of the trunk that Larry and his friends had found. It appeared to have blood on it and they felt maybe the boys were moved on it. He was also bringing it to Dr Malick to test, but Lieutenant Mitchell took it and said they would test it, which, by the way, they never did. They would test it, which, by the way, they never did. So back to the prosecutor's hearing. When the Ives go to meet with Garrett they also are introduced to Don Harmon, who was Garrett's business partner at the time. And let's pause again for me to tell you just a little bit about Harmon, because you will hear his name a lot.
Speaker 1:
Harmon was a prosecuting attorney in Arkansas in the 70s and in the 80s. He was running again and unopposed when, without warning, he just drops completely out of the race, files bankruptcy and leaves the state. Four months later he returns and opens a private law office. Four months later he returns and opens a private law office. He also served as special prosecuting attorney in 1984 in an embezzlement case at the hospital in Saline County. The hearing took three days, and there were 33 witnesses that were called, which was EMT, those on the train officers and anyone that was around that night. Most of the time was spent questioning Dr Malik, though, of course, who was a total joke on the sand. So on February 26, 1988, gary issued a report that overturned Dr Malik's ruling from accidental to undetermined.
Speaker 3:
Okay, so this is at least a small victory from the family. At least it's something. I'm sure that they've made enemies out of all of these detectives now, but really that's kind of on the detectives.
Speaker 1:
Right. So after this, harmon and Garrett come to the families again and they ask how they feel about having the boys' bodies exhumed and sent to another forensic pathologist for more autopsies, and they of course agree because they know this was really botched the first time. So in the meantime Garrett talks to the judge about Herman being the special prosecutor for a grand jury into the deaths of the boys which was branded. So Dr Joseph Burton examined the bodies and he also finds Don was stabbed in the back and Kevin's face was smashed in with what appears to be the butt of a gun. Also, there is evidence of THC, but not anywhere to the level that Dr Malick said, and so they realized that the blood was never even tested by Dr Malick the first time.
Speaker 3:
So dude, just straight up lied about the THC levels, not to mention their so-called psychedelic effects, it appears that way and Dr Burton wants to change the cause of death from undetermined to homicide.
Speaker 1:
and they have two other forensic pathologists who do separate studies which come to the same conclusion as Dr Burton did With the grand jury they changed the cause of death to homicide.
Speaker 3:
Okay, I do want to talk about the investigation, but first I want to know did anything, if anything, but did anything happen to Dr Malik?
Speaker 1:
So Linda goes to the media about the issues with Dr Malik and it comes to light of 20 other cases that he had royally screwed up, just that they know of. For instance, there was a man named Raymond Albright who was shot five times in the chest and Dr Malik had the cause of death as suicide.
Speaker 3:
That must have been Superman shooting himself five times Right.
Speaker 1:
So there was also a man named James Milliman. He was literally decapitated and Dr Malick put cause of death as an ulcer. I didn't know ulcers could do that. There's this crazy public outrage and the people are really rallying for him to be removed as medical examiner. So at this time we had Bill Clinton as our governor and he could have removed him, but he said that Dr Malik was probably overworked and underpaid. We also had Jocelyn Elders, which was the Arkansas medical examiner's Commissioner Chairman. That could have also removed him at the time, but rather than either one of them removing him, he got a 41% raise. So I mean, he may still be overworked, but he's not underpaid.
Speaker 3:
Yes, the underpaid part is the part that right. That's the part that's causing him to royally screw these up, not the overworked part. As long as he's getting more money, he'll be a little more detailed. These don't even seem like details, they just seem like made up. Almost feels like he's playing a game on the lottery, just picking up. Oh also, oh suicide, oh accident.
Speaker 1:
Oh which I have my own assumptions as to why that is.
Speaker 3:
Also, I know y'all couldn't see me, but I was definitely picking up pretend balls as I was doing that. That was me picking up pretend lottery with a name on it.
Speaker 1:
Just remembered y'all can't see me though I do have my own assumptions, but I'll probably just keep those to myself, because I mean we do live in in Arkansas and I don't want to die, so it has to do with the Clinton. So the grand jury does change the manner of death, but a suspect wasn't named. What did happen is that those that are to be called to testify, or did testify, begin to die or disappear. So we have Keith Connie, who was going to testify that the boys were killed by police, and he dies in a motorcycle wreck while being chased.
Speaker 3:
I'm interested in the policing one now.
Speaker 1:
Well, also his neck was slit, so that's kind of really weird in a motorcycle accident. But that was also a weird detail. But so we also also have keith mccaskill, who alleged to be at the train tracks that night and was going to testify, but he is stabbed 113 times in his house in november of 1988 oh yes, I bet that was classified by the medical examiner as cancer.
Speaker 1:
No, I didn't put that in here, but there is actually. The neighbor boy was at one time convicted, even went to prison, as being the killer, but he was later exonerated. Yes, so to this day it's actually not been solved. I'm surprised that they didn't just call that cancer, no joke. So it's still unresolved to this day. So we also have a guy named Booney Burden that was a friend of Greg Collins. That disappeared in March of 1989.
Speaker 1:
We also have Greg Collins that was subpoenaed but was shot in the face in January of 1989. Oh, he probably died of the flu. Probably Jeff Grimes. That told his family he knew too much about the murders of the boys and about the McCaskill murder and was shot in April of 1989. Polio, I don't know. That was kind of past its time then. It doesn't matter for them, that is true. So Richard Winters did testify for the grand jury and he was gunned down in July of 1989. And there's a brain tumor. There's a few others according to a documentary called Obstruction of Justice, the Munich Connection, which is really interesting if you want to look at that. But it's just crazy, all these people just showing up dying here in Saline County and you're just like how does this even happen? We don't even have this much murder in Saline County. All of these people that were testifying are going to testify. All died of really strange natural causes. It's crazy.
Speaker 3:
Yeah, it is truly wild and I mean I want to know exactly what's going on in this city, because these people are dying rapidly.
Speaker 1:
And it's odd, that is really true. So what the actual consensus was was that the boys saw drugs most likely cocaine drop from a plane in the woods that night. No-transcript, I don't remember hearing that.
Speaker 3:
Okay, I don't understand how this is connected, though.
Speaker 1:
Right, and I spent a lot of time on that.
Speaker 3:
I'm so glad that you did so.
Speaker 1:
You can share it with us. I'm going to try to really convince this as much as possible, because this could be a whole podcast in itself and maybe someday it will, but for the sense of time I'll just try to do the best I can. So there was this man named Barry Seals that began importing mostly cocaine from out of the country, mainly from Columbia. He started out in Baton Rouge is where he was dropping all of his cocaine, but then he moved to a very small town in Arkansas called Meaden. He had his own hangar there and then he started getting a fleet of planes hired others to smuggle drugs and he also had these panels cut out of these planes that weren't. This wasn't in regulation or anything, but he had these panels cut out so that he could drop the drugs out of the plane without having to land or anything, just drop them where he needs them. And so the whole story is actually really fascinating to me. But the gist of it is he was gunned down in 1986 by the cartel.
Speaker 3:
Okay, first of all, I don't know why you've explained that the drug cartel guy did something that was not up to regulation with his plate. Seems pretty clear that he's not going to follow any rules, true, but anyway. So the boys were killed in 1987. So that's a whole year later. Still not getting the connection, okay.
Speaker 1:
So supposedly there were airdrops in that area. Often in this area of Saline County People in the area can get planes of low flying planes with their lots off. Just all the noise, all this stuff in that area. And although, barry Dodd, it was believed the business, if that's what you want to call it for many sources you'll find that the elected officials in central Arkansas seemed to have a very big drug issue at the time and pretty much just a drug ring going on.
Speaker 1:
And so in 1990, the prosecutor of the 7th Judicial District, gary Arnold's office, received state funding to set up a drug task force and Jean Duffy was requested to be the administrator, although this was not what Arnold wanted at all. And on her very first day Arnold approaches her and he advises her that she is not to use the joint task force to investigate a public official at all and this wasn't even her plan going into this job. But she has seven investigators and they were investigating where and when they needed and where she thought of it. Yeah, so then they find dan harman, which we talked about, who's running again for prosecuting attorney unimposed, and he's linked to drug trafficking. She took her findings to assistant us attorney bob govar, who was heading a grand jury for backfinding into public officials of Saline County which, by the way, there was so many grand juries in this. That was crazy, I'm sorry. They just do not seem to like grand juries at this time.
Speaker 3:
My favorite thing so far is that they went to Duffy and they were like don't look into public officials, and she's like that wasn't really my plan, but you know what it is now. Thanks for that option.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, thanks for giving me that clue, yeah, so Govar assured her that Harmon would soon be indicted, as well as others, and we know that grand juries are private and the witness list is also private, or supposedly private.
Speaker 1:
Right, and some of these people died of an ulcer but happened to be cavitated. So one of the witnesses they have testify is a lady named Charlene Wilson. She had at one point been the girlfriend of Roger Clinton, which is Bill's half-brother. She had also dated Harmon she's getting around with the public official, no joke and she says that both the Clintons as well as Harmon had parties all the time. Some were toga parties. Isn't that frat? I know it does sound like a crazy frat party. So and she says cocaine was flowing freely all the time. Again, is it a frat? It does very much sound like that. But I mean, you don't really have money for cocaine at frat parties, steve, unless your rich parents are finding out.
Speaker 1:
Maybe I don't know I wasn't in a frat park you know, into cocaine.
Speaker 3:
Right, we've been to one togo party. There's no cocaine.
Speaker 1:
I feel like maybe I just went to a toga party and there was no drugs at all. So I don't know. So Gophar is ready to ask for indictments. But his boss, who is Chuck Banks, comes in and he shuts down the gray injury completely, he sends everybody home, he dismantles the investigation and Gophar is actually demoted and go for is actually demoted. So Banks holds a news conference and says all like all Saline County public officials are clear to any allegations of drug-related public misconduct and other forms of wrongdoing at all.
Speaker 3:
I mean, can he even do that?
Speaker 1:
Well, so according to Duffy which I didn't really know a lot about grand juries, but according to Duffy the grand jury could have still voted, but they probably were not aware of that and they could have still indicted people if they wanted to, but I don't think that they knew that.
Speaker 3:
they could have done that. I mean, do they pick grand juries like they pick regular juries? Yes, yeah, nobody knows that, but they have.
Speaker 1:
They have more on the grand jury than they do regular jury and it's very private. But I don't think they tell you all that okay, if we dismantle you, you can still have voting rights.
Speaker 3:
They probably don't tell you stuff like that no, no, normal, regular, non-true crime citizen is just me like uh, hey guys, let's get together and vote because we can still do that. I didn't even know that, so I watched. Well, here is your tip everybody if you are on a grand jury and they dismantle you, you still have you all the power.
Speaker 1:
You can still indict whoever you want, you can still vote. But even if you're indicted, it doesn't mean you're charged, so it may not mean anything, but you could still indict somebody if you wanted. Toicted it doesn't mean you're charged, so it may not mean anything, but you could still indict somebody if you wanted to.
Speaker 3:
Wouldn't it be a record, though, that they were at least indicted I don't know, indicted on a crime? Maybe, it doesn't matter, you didn't get there in your rabbit hole.
Speaker 1:
No, I was going to do too many things.
Speaker 3:
Alright, so it was a complete waste of their time.
Speaker 1:
Next. That is true, so it's a complete waste of time. It's completely dismantled. So, according to Duffy, the grand jury could have still voted, like I said. So Harmon does end up winning the election and guess who he fires, which is Duffy, but he also tries to hold a grand jury which I said they had a lot of, and subpoena any information that Duffy has on him Again, not a lawyer, don't really know a lot about law, but that sounds kind of fishy.
Speaker 1:
So I would think so that you could not get a subpoena, but he did get a subpoena for this information, for the grand jury, for Duffy, to get any information she had on him, which I'm just I'm still, I work with law every day and we do get subpoenas and I'm still not really, I'm not really wrapping my head around that. So something else Harmon does is he gets a search warrant for none other than Charlene Wilson's house for probable drugs reported by a you can't see my hands but a so-called confidential informant.
Speaker 3:
Was it himself, since he's the one doing drugs.
Speaker 1:
I'm just confused here. So wait, there's more. They supposedly find drugs in her house and none other than Harmon arrests her. I mean Harmon, the prosecuting attorney, arrests her.
Speaker 3:
Does a dude walk around with handcuffs? How can he do that? Is it a citizen? The prosecuting attorney does this. Is this technically a citizen's arrest? Because I don't think he has the right to arrest people and this is his ex-girlfriend right.
Speaker 1:
yes, okay that testified against him into the grand jury. That went nowhere. That is supposed to be private and nobody knows. Right, that guy also died of an auto accident. I never dropped that part so, um, what did she say? So she alleges he said I you. If you ever tell anyone about our dealings or anything that happens between us, it would be very bad for you. So get this. She ends up getting 30 years in prison for his first crime drug offense for drug possession.
Speaker 3:
I bet she had a psychedelic amount of marijuana. So we have murderers and we have rapists and they get back on the street quicker than this one-time drug possession. That was clearly fake and no one is like raising raising an eyebrow, like not adding up.
Speaker 1:
I know. So you have some that are probably suspicious. But I mean, honestly, look what happens to anybody that has looked into anything. True, you're gonna be dead. So you've been demoted or you've been fired.
Speaker 3:
Or you've been killed, or you're going to prison or prison, yeah, and I'd probably keep my mouth shut too, or I'd hide, like Duffy did.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, so this is like the good old boy system to the nth degree, because this is just crazy. So John Brown, who was elected the new sheriff, did take a sworn deposition for Charlene Wilson, who claims to have been at the tracks the night the boys were killed, and she claims that Harmon as well as others were there too, and she also states this in a documentary, but the other names are inaudible. I'm not sure why that is not in there with them. So at some point the state police let Linda look through their files that they have, which I'm also completely unsure why this even happened, because I mean, you can't even look at this stuff unless the case is closed.
Speaker 3:
Well, that's not true, the police can give you access, but you can't do. You normally can't leave the office with them unless it's a closed case.
Speaker 1:
I can only get my bags into closed.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, it's completely up to the people, up to the officers, so they do let them to look at what they do have. She finds a lot of interesting things that she feels probably wasn't fully investigated. Well, one thing that really stuck out to me, though, and it was a diagram made by a man named Ronnie Goodwin. He was driving home from the bar one night Well, actually the night that the boys died. He's on his way and he sees an unmarked police car and, not wanting the DWI, he goes another way to avoid the police car and he pulls over and he shuts off his lights and plans on waiting out the police.
Speaker 1:
So he stops in this trailer to park about two trailers down, but he is still watching him, and he passed this store. He sees two cops with two boys. One boy was on the ground on his knees with his head down. The officer picked him up and threw him in the car. The other officer hit the other boy at the payphone and the hand with the phone. Once he was hit he went down and then he was placed in the police car. He at first thought the boys must have been robbing the store, but later realized that it had to be Kevin and Dawn.
Speaker 3:
This is all so crazy. Do they have any idea who these officers were? They?
Speaker 1:
have a good idea from my understanding, but to my knowledge nothing was ever done. So in 1993, linda gets a call from a guy who says he was a friend of the boys and he was told a story about the deaths and he's scared to talk to Linda or the police. But he says he thinks he can get this guy to talk to her and she'll listen. And she of course is like yes, I want to hear the story, even though she's like I'm not even sure if this is going to go anywhere. So in what I read of the documents he is just referred to as CI. So he was 12 at the time and he tells Linda that some friends and Helen were also in the woods the night that the boys died.
Speaker 1:
They were looking for a leched marijuana patch. He saw two young boys with a lot walking the tracks. A group of men approached them and he claims one was Harmon. They hear gunfire in his room, take off running, and then he did too. She asked how would you even know that was Harmon after all this time? And he said because his mother used to date Harmon. That is how he knew that was Harmon after all this time. And he said because his mother used to date Harmon. That is how he knew that was.
Speaker 3:
Harmon Plot twist, man, they just keep coming, don't they yes.
Speaker 1:
So he is later questioned by the FBI and polygraphed. He also puts Keith McCaskill there, which we know was he's been murdered. Yeah, he's been murdered.
Speaker 3:
I mean I'm sorry, he had a motorcycle accident.
Speaker 1:
No, that wasn't him. This was someone stabbed 113 times. Oh, okay, so he is dead before he got to testify to anything. So they put this boy that testifies that they just called the CO. They put him in protective custody for a while but he decided he didn't want to remain in protective custody and he left. So April 11th 1997, the federal grand jury released an indictment on none other than Harmon. So Harmon faced two counts of possession with intent to distribute cocaine, four counts of conspiracy to extort money, two counts of conspiracy to manufacture drugs and one count of witness tampering and one count of retaliation against a witness.
Speaker 3:
Okay so, we know that just because you're indicted doesn't mean it goes anywhere, but I hope that in this case that it definitely does. And also, if we're doing prison math, like Harmon did prison math, I think that equals a death sentence probably so.
Speaker 1:
surprisingly enough, he did go to trial. He was convicted of federal racketeering, extortion, drug conspiracy and drug charges and federal drug crimes.
Speaker 3:
And I would like to reiterate that if Charlene got 30 years, I think the math for him is the death penalty.
Speaker 1:
Well, it doesn't work like that, but I do agree with you. But he was back out by 2006, so not even 10 years he served. And then in 2010, he was charged with drug delivery charges, but acquitted of those charges, he ended up dying in 2023.
Speaker 1:
And it was probably a peaceful death, which is really annoying, probably, and I could probably spend our entire time just talking about Harmon and all the craziness of his whole life and all the crazy stories he did. But this story isn't about Harmon. It is about two boys that, as of today, still have not received justice. No one has ever been convicted of their deaths. At this point, all that were named to them responsible have passed and I hate to say it, but I don't think we will ever have this case be solved.
Speaker 1:
It's crazy, cover-up, scandal, power in the wrong places and we don't really use this platform to use political or religious beliefs, and this isn't where you come from to get your political or religious beliefs. But this is where the story led in this and it was just a crazy little cover-up and it's just crazy. So it's out there if you have time to take a very deep dive into more of this, because there are so many more things that you can look into, but we just do not have that kind of time to cover all of that.
Speaker 3:
Yes, but you know, maybe go look at some of these death certificates.
Speaker 1:
I bet those shock you we always recommend more bubbly and less OJ Cheers. We always recommend more bubbly and less OJ Cheers.
Speaker 3:
If you'd like to see pictures from today's episode, you can find us at murdermimosas on Instagram. You can also find us at murdermimosas on TikTok, twitter, and if you have a case you would like us to do, you can send that to murdermimosas at gmailcom. And lastly, we are on Facebook at Murder and Mimosas Podcast, where you can interact with us there. We love any type of feedback you can give us, so please rate and review us on Spotify, itunes or wherever you listen to your podcasts.